Forum changes: Editing of posts has been turned off until further notice.
Started by chadu, November 25, 2005, 12:29:56 AM
Quote from: Ron Edwards on November 23, 2005, 04:00:44 PMDespite our differences in style and hot-buttons, I am seeing a crucial consensus among Ralph, Luke, Clinton, Keith, me, and others. It is:Given POD printing and internet ordering, as well as useful fulfilment houses, there is no reason for further centralization of any step of the current model.Which means tossing POD into the hands of a single distributor is no "solution" - because there's no current problem, at least not for us, nor for anyone who wants to do what we do.(snip)The "solution" is nothing but a barrel of unnecessary and disastrous problems, the more so because no actual problem exists. Printing has never been easier, nor capable of such great-looking product for so little money. What I see in your "solution," Sean, is that distributors are desperate to make themselves relevant in some way, now that they've effectively become obsolete. So, they have a problem. Not us.
Quote from: Bob Goat on November 25, 2005, 08:32:28 AMYou got a good point, but it is being answered to a certain extent. I know over at IPR we have begun selling directly to retailers and that seems to be pretty successful so far. A lot of the publishers there are hawking POD products. Also, it bypasses the distributor and consolidates a whole bunch of publishers into one area for ordering purposes.
Quote from: Ron Edwards on November 25, 2005, 10:59:26 AMSince distribution is unreliable, exactly as Ryan described in the parent thread, it typically fails even to meet the needs you've stated. Chad, you rightly point out that we can't rely on a "would" statement from people, as in they "would have" bought the game from the store, as if it were rock solid. But I do agree that they might be real needs, at least to a small extent, for a few people, I completely agree that having my books in stores which (a) can stock them reliably and (b) re-order them once sold is a fine thing, although as I've stated, not a make-or-break issue.
Quote from: Ron Edwards on November 25, 2005, 10:59:26 AMBut there's no traditional distributor in that picture. Looks right, looks left, looks under chair ... nope, not there.
Quote from: Ron Edwards on November 25, 2005, 11:50:45 AMH'm. I guess I'm not seeing the same opening/window you are, or maybe we're not communicating well ...As I see it, the retailers who refuse to consider anything but looking in GCQ or their single distributor's order-list are the same ones who would not benefit us, or any publisher really, through ordering. They order what their weird little rumor-community considers hot at the moment, plus slush-piles with a little extra cash once in a while, and do not re-order specific titles from those slush-piles based on sales. This is not hearsay or speculation on my part. These guys brag about this.So I see zero return in expanding store-presence beyond those retailers who do the (a-b) I described before. Those guys are serving their customers and me; the other guys are not, so any effort to get into those stores is wasted. A sale through such a store isn't worth much because it's not followed by an immediate, reliable re-order.Chad, it seems to me that you're advocating making that extra effort which I am saying isn't worth it. All for the benefit of what seems to me very iffy, very few, very low-return, unsustained sales.
Quote from: chadu on November 25, 2005, 12:06:27 PMWould you agree in that light that there is some mild value in the distro system?
Quote from: me"The reason that Ron is reluctant to get involved is because, to affect lasting change, and to not simply throw thimbles of water on a maddening fire, you can't simply shuffle your products into standard distro yourself (even if you find an easy way to shuffle your products into the standard distro system)."
Quote from: chadu on November 25, 2005, 12:06:27 PMIf anything, I'm advocating making a mild effort (once systems/processes come online to make this much more trivial, like IPR and the RPGNow distro entry) for marketing purposes -- game on shelves, game in minds. Serving those cloistered customers and retailers is a side-effect.If the system or process doesn't cost me money -- or better yet earns me something -- it's a better deal than buying advertising space somewhere, strictly in terms of a marketing effort.