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Author Topic: Many a question  (Read 4587 times)
lemmiwinks
Member

Posts: 14


« on: August 24, 2003, 07:30:59 PM »

Ran through a few questionable parts of playing today, so I hope somebody can help out with these, I'll just list the dilemna in numerical fashoin and hopefully somebody can give a good answer.

1) When half-swording does the damage go up +3 to plate armor or all armor types?  Doesn't it make this manuever a little strong seing as that the ATN, DTN AND damage usually go up? Why not always half sword if it wasn't for the rang, even the loss of range (medium range) with +3 damage in addition to the normal +1 damage of a greatsword thrust makes it ST+4, and lower ATN, DTN... it beats out every sword.

Also it makes it stronger than any other spear, which makes no sense because spears are used exactly the same way and are meant for that particular attack, so why do they have a higher ATN, a higher DTN and less damage?

2) Does the flail negate two successes for parrying weapons as well or for only shield blocks?

3) When having multiple opponents and a target evades, does the evade go to both targets or not?  What if at the beginning of the round they do the movement "hurried or sprinting" check to effectively outmanuever the opponents, don't they get a chance to do something to stop this?  I think multiple opponents against a single guy is kind of difficult when taking in to effect evasion as well as the manuevering.  What is the strike order for these kinds of occasions?

4) If any extra shock damage at the end of the round is applied to a character then it is transferred over to the next round?  Doesn't that mean that the last person to get hit in a round will always get carryover shock because he will have used his pool on his defense?  

5) Doesn't knockback/knockdown change as battle goes on?  Wouldn't somebody that's significantly weakened have a higher chance of falling down?

6) Why get a heater shield over a medium shield if the heater takes up more CP and has the same DTN number?

7) How do you disarm another opponent?  I'd guess it would be beat I don't understand why that ability doesn't say anything about disarming.
Forgot my other questions but if you have any answers to this I'd appreciate it.  I will have more later on.
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Draigh
Member

Posts: 151


« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2003, 08:49:04 PM »

Lemmiwinks, I can't give you any "official" answers, but I'll answer your questions as I've played the situations... The answers you'd get from Jake or Brian could be a hell of a lot different, so don't hold it against me if they are. :-)



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1) When half-swording does the damage go up +3 to plate armor or all armor types? Doesn't it make this manuever a little strong seing as that the ATN, DTN AND damage usually go up? Why not always half sword if it wasn't for the rang, even the loss of range (medium range) with +3 damage in addition to the normal +1 damage of a greatsword thrust makes it ST+4, and lower ATN, DTN... it beats out every sword.



Generally, I apply half-sword bonuses to all metal armors.  Why not always half-sword?  Range and timing...  if I were using a longsword, I'd feel really uncomfortable letting everyone I fought into grappling range.  I tend to think of half-swording more as a last resort, once they've already gotten to withing your reach, to end the fight quickly before they end it... get it?


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Also it makes it stronger than any other spear, which makes no sense because spears are used exactly the same way and are meant for that particular attack, so why do they have a higher ATN, a higher DTN and less damage?



I allow people to use many half-swording maneuvers with a spear, if it's not over 7' long, and if they're familiar with fighting that way.  I don't know that it's historically accurate though... but I'm not running a "historical" game.


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2) Does the flail negate two successes for parrying weapons as well or for only shield blocks?



Both. *edit*: Yes... that's what I meant by both, in case it wasn't clear. *end edit*


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3) When having multiple opponents and a target evades, does the evade go to both targets or not? What if at the beginning of the round they do the movement "hurried or sprinting" check to effectively outmanuever the opponents, don't they get a chance to do something to stop this? I think multiple opponents against a single guy is kind of difficult when taking in to effect evasion as well as the manuevering. What is the strike order for these kinds of occasions?


Evade would go to both targets.  Opposed terrain rolls to outmanuever each other, and go with order of reflex and initiative.  For instance, Aleksandr is fighting two gols.  At the beginning of the fight, he rolls terrain to try to only fight one at a time, and they roll to keep him between them.  They beat him, and are both engaged with him in combat.
Both of them go offensive, playing the odds, and he goes defensive, trying to full evade.  Roll attack for each gol, and evasion for Aleksandr, and if he beats both of their successes, he's evaded them.


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4) If any extra shock damage at the end of the round is applied to a character then it is transferred over to the next round? Doesn't that mean that the last person to get hit in a round will always get carryover shock because he will have used his pool on his defense?



Yeah, pretty much, but remember to try to resolve combats in a more cinematic manner than you would in DnD or Gurps or whatever... try to split it up into small individual combats, and fight with group A for a few rounds before going to group B, then to group C.  That way, you're making combat flow more than restricting it to metered steps in time... know what I mean?


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5) Doesn't knockback/knockdown change as battle goes on? Wouldn't somebody that's significantly weakened have a higher chance of falling down?



Anything that would adversly affect your CP would adversly affect your Knockdown and Knockout rolls, in my opinion.


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6) Why get a heater shield over a medium shield if the heater takes up more CP and has the same DTN number?



Higher armor value, and probably different coverage.


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7) How do you disarm another opponent? I'd guess it would be beat I don't understand why that ability doesn't say anything about disarming.



Disarming an opponent is a possible effect to a successful counter.  If you are specifically trying to disarm an opponent, I would suggest a beat, followed by a reflex test by the defender at  TN 7 + attacker's MOS.
Or, you could always just cut the guy's arm off at the wrist... that works too.  

Hope I helped.
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Drink to the dead all you, still alive.
We shall join them, in good time.
If you go crossing that silvery brook it's best to leap before you look.
Overdrive
Member

Posts: 100


« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2003, 09:01:30 PM »

Quote from: Draigh
Why not always half-sword?  Range and timing...  if I were using a longsword, I'd feel really uncomfortable letting everyone I fought into grappling range.  I tend to think of half-swording more as a last resort, once they've already gotten to withing your reach, to end the fight quickly before they end it... get it?

And compared to an arming sword, the longsword is, well, longer. An arming sword could be more easily concealed, doesn't get stuck in those tight tunnels and is generally easier to carry around.
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lemmiwinks
Member

Posts: 14


« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2003, 09:27:53 PM »

So flails do go around parrying weapons?  I know in the description it just talks about being made to go around blocking shields.

When halfswording the greatsword TN's go down and the damage goes up, I still don't understand why a 2h sword wielder wouldn't want to use this tactic right away.  Not only is the user more capable of defending himself but of also inflicting more damage.

I also don't understand the physics behind the manuever, how does a half thrust employ more power than the full swing of a 2h sword.  The mass and inertia applied by the swing must be devestatingly more powerful than a simple thrust...
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Brian Leybourne
Member

Posts: 1793


« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2003, 10:03:05 PM »

See, that's what's so great about this forum. Jake and I don't even have to answer questions usually - someone else will do it for us. :-)

Draigh is pretty much spot on.

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So flails do go around parrying weapons? I know in the description it just talks about being made to go around blocking shields.


Yup, I certainly play it that way.

Quote
When halfswording the greatsword TN's go down and the damage goes up, I still don't understand why a 2h sword wielder wouldn't want to use this tactic right away. Not only is the user more capable of defending himself but of also inflicting more damage.


Range plays a very large role in combat, and half-swording shortens it considerably. Also, it denies you swinging attacks.

Quote
I also don't understand the physics behind the manuever, how does a half thrust employ more power than the full swing of a 2h sword. The mass and inertia applied by the swing must be devestatingly more powerful than a simple thrust...


Apart from anything else, all the power of the attack goes into a single point instead of being applied along a plane (the blade). Also, when halfswording it's possible to aim for chinks or weak points in a suit of armor, which is not as easily done while swinging. This is represented by the greater damage versus metal armors as well.

Brian.
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Brian Leybourne
bleybourne@gmail.com

RPG Books: Of Beasts and Men, The Flower of Battle, The TROS Companion
Draigh
Member

Posts: 151


« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2003, 10:04:42 PM »

Lemmiwinks wrote:
Quote
So flails do go around parrying weapons? I know in the description it just talks about being made to go around blocking shields



I don't see why not.


Lemmiwinks wrote:
Quote
When halfswording the greatsword TN's go down and the damage goes up, I still don't understand why a 2h sword wielder wouldn't want to use this tactic right away. Not only is the user more capable of defending himself but of also inflicting more damage.

I also don't understand the physics behind the manuever, how does a half thrust employ more power than the full swing of a 2h sword. The mass and inertia applied by the swing must be devestatingly more powerful than a simple thrust...



To answer the first part of your question: The reach while half-swording goes from long to medium or short, at player's descretion.  Reach is an important part of the value of a longsword or greatsword, as being able to cut your opponent to pieces before he can even touch you is better than giving him the chance to cut you up.  If you are weilding a longsword, and your opponent is weilding a longsword half-sworded, he's going to have to pay a penalty to get past your reach to attack you.  Half-swording gives you the ability to still be effective once your opponent has gotten within the reach of your weapon, and makes quick thrusts a real threat, whereas using the weapon normally gives you the ability to make devistating cuts, and keep your opponent off of you.  From my expierience with martial arts, the worst thing you can do to someone who is used to having the ability to hit you at long range is to get within that range.  Cuts aren't that effective while half-swording, as I recall, and they do less damage (unless it changed in the revision of the rules).

As far as the physics behind it are concerned, you're effectively "choking up" on the blade, reinforcing it's strength and stiffness, and therefore it's penetrating ability.

Maybe that'll help
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Drink to the dead all you, still alive.
We shall join them, in good time.
If you go crossing that silvery brook it's best to leap before you look.
lemmiwinks
Member

Posts: 14


« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2003, 11:51:03 PM »

Thanks for the quick replies guys, still a few more Q's though :P

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Quote
3) When having multiple opponents and a target evades, does the evade go to both targets or not? What if at the beginning of the round they do the movement "hurried or sprinting" check to effectively outmanuever the opponents, don't they get a chance to do something to stop this? I think multiple opponents against a single guy is kind of difficult when taking in to effect evasion as well as the manuevering. What is the strike order for these kinds of occasions?


Evade would go to both targets.  Opposed terrain rolls to outmanuever each other, and go with order of reflex and initiative.  For instance, Aleksandr is fighting two gols.  At the beginning of the fight, he rolls terrain to try to only fight one at a time, and they roll to keep him between them.  They beat him, and are both engaged with him in combat.
Both of them go offensive, playing the odds, and he goes defensive, trying to full evade.  Roll attack for each gol, and evasion for Aleksandr, and if he beats both of their successes, he's evaded them.


What would the attacker's TN number be for the terrain roll in hte beginning?  While the person with two opponents would have a 6 or 5, the two opponents would only be on level ground and have a TN of 0, or am I off?

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5) Doesn't knockback/knockdown change as battle goes on? Wouldn't somebody that's significantly weakened have a higher chance of falling down?


Anything that would adversly affect your CP would adversly affect your Knockdown and Knockout rolls, in my opinion.


I think that's a good rule.  Though the only time you would ever need to roll a knockdown or knockout is when you were hit in the first place, and therefore have lost CP... so the knockdown and knockout would merely act as base numbers for which a person must subtract from for their rolls.


Quote
Quote
7) How do you disarm another opponent? I'd guess it would be beat I don't understand why that ability doesn't say anything about disarming.



Disarming an opponent is a possible effect to a successful counter.  If you are specifically trying to disarm an opponent, I would suggest a beat, followed by a reflex test by the defender at  TN 7 + attacker's MOS.
Or, you could always just cut the guy's arm off at the wrist... that works too.  

Hope I helped.


I like that rule a lot.
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Brian Leybourne
Member

Posts: 1793


« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2003, 02:07:39 AM »

Quote from: lemmiwinks
What would the attacker's TN number be for the terrain roll in hte beginning?  While the person with two opponents would have a 6 or 5, the two opponents would only be on level ground and have a TN of 0, or am I off?


I use the same TN for the oppnents. AFter all, they have to maneuver around each other (or at least coordinate with each other) to try to cut you off.

Quote from: lemmiwinks
I think that's a good rule.  Though the only time you would ever need to roll a knockdown or knockout is when you were hit in the first place, and therefore have lost CP... so the knockdown and knockout would merely act as base numbers for which a person must subtract from for their rolls.


If you're talking about the person being weakened not as a result of injury but battle fatigue and wearyness etc, then simply apply the fatigue CP penalty to knockdown and knockout pools as well. Problem solved! :-)

Brian.
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Brian Leybourne
bleybourne@gmail.com

RPG Books: Of Beasts and Men, The Flower of Battle, The TROS Companion
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