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Author Topic: Is the Fonz a passer demon?  (Read 2183 times)
Tasseomancer
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Posts: 13


« on: December 04, 2008, 02:04:26 AM »

This following on from a discussion we were having over at snail's pace.
On the subject of the 'user' of demon powers.

Now I understand that the user can be someone other than the demon or it's master.
That makes sense. So taking vitality as the example: a master with wish to be a healer could ask his demon to confer vitality to a patient.
Now here's the catch. What if the patient doesn't want to be healed? Does he have no choice? Or would this be resolved as a conflict? Or would it just fail?
In the house example in the main rulebook. It confers travel to people in the house. Would they be able to resist?

Next point, can the user be not just 'anyone' but 'anything'. Could the passer demon 'the Fonz' confer vitality to a broken jukebox? It's fixed.

Now vitality is a special case as it doesn't need the user to control the power.

Could a power be confered to an object but controlled by the demon or master?

So in summary is the Fonz a passer demon with vitality and is Richie Cunningham his master?



   
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Ron Edwards
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« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2008, 09:16:30 AM »

Hello,

To be clear to others reading, I'll distinguish between the power working at all vs. the power being employed in a given moment. The demon always controls whether the power works. If the power is not defined as conferred, then it only works for the demon. If it is so defined, then it is not under the demon's control except insofar as it works at all. The demon also decides to whom it is conferred.

Your healer example does work. And yes, if the patient resists receiving the conferral, then it's a conflict. However, if the patient does have the ability conferred, then it's still up to the patient to use it. I clarify this point below.

In the house example, the issue is again not really whether the people get the Travel usage, although it is possible to resist at that point just as stated above. I'll double-check the text soon to address this example further; rather than rely only on my memory at the moment.

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Next point, can the user be not just 'anyone' but 'anything'. Could the passer demon 'the Fonz' confer vitality to a broken jukebox? It's fixed.

No. That would require Warp and an appropriate Cover (either the demon ability or the basic real-person version).

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Could a power be confered to an object but controlled by the demon or master?

I think the distinction between confer and control is getting off the beam here, because control at the light-switch level is what is conferred, whereas the demon always exerts control at the circuit-breaker level. You're also bringing in some kind of three-way deal here, when the choices are either one (demon = circuit-breaker + light-switch) or two (demon = circuit-breaker, other user = light-switch).

I think I can answer by clarifying that objects cannot use demon abilities, period. They may be affected by them in some way.

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Now vitality is a special case as it doesn't need the user to control the power.

That's incorrect, as the user still decides to use the ability (assuming the demon is permitting it to function). Vitality is just like Armor in this regard; it's most practical to play it as "activates on impact," but that is short-hand for the point that the user has prepared himself or herself to use it as such. If the user does not want Vitality or Armor to apply, the ability is switched off.

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So in summary is the Fonz a passer demon with vitality and is Richie Cunningham his master?

I did watch Happy Days when it first came out in 1974, but not for long, so I either have too much context to understand your question or too little. The point is that I don't understand it. What do you mean?

Best, Ron
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Tasseomancer
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Posts: 13


« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2008, 02:40:04 PM »

Thanks Ron, for the swift response.

1. Ok, I get it. The person receiving the ability can resist getting it, but at the end of the day if if they have it they still can decide if they want to switch it on or not (or allow it to activate in the case of armour and vitality). Though the demon of course has the final say if it's going to let him.

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Q. Could the passer demon confer vitality to a broken jukebox to fix it.
A. No. That would require Warp and an appropriate Cover (either the demon ability or the basic real-person version).

2. But Warp states the effect lasts only the Demon's Power in hours. So would the repaired item breakdown again after this time? And if so is there a permanent way to mend something with powers?

3. Oh I was basically asking. demon (circuit breaker), user (light switch), master (operating the switch). Which I now know is not possible.

4. I get this now see 1.

5. It was a joke and if you have to explain them they are no longer funny but here goes anyway.

In the mid 70's (now I'm showing my age) 'The Fonz' was a leather jacketed Italian-American mechanic in the TV show 'Happy Days'. He was known for his catchphrases: "Whoa", and "Aaay!" while snapping his fingers, and forming a thrust-forward double thumbs up.
He was previously with two gangs, the Demons and the Falcons, his redemption began in the months before the series. The Fonz intervened in a rumble to which gang members had challenged high school student Richie Cunningham. Intervening to save Richie, he developed respect for Fonzie, and despite their differences, the two developed a friendship. While Richie learned the world from Fonz, Fonzie learned about a tight-knit family from the Cunninghams, from whom he eventually rented an attic room.
Sounds like Richie summoning a passing demon called Fonzie to save him.
The Fonz could do things like walk into a dark room, snap his fingers, and turn on the lights. Or pound his fist on the hood of a car, and start the engine or on a juke box and get it to play a song. Opponents larger than himself back down from confrontations. Those who do confront him never come out on top.
Sounds like Passer Demon with Warp and the cover (mechanic). Now I wonder what power he'd need to jump a shark ;) Now I'm not explaining that joke you'll have to read the wiki. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jumping_the_shark

Mark
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Ron Edwards
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« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2008, 03:08:39 PM »

Whoa, you missed my point: I watched Happy Days' first season, back in the day; I was ten. You didn't have explain any of the basic basics. My point was that I didn't watch it long enough to follow much of an arc for any of the characters.

Given your explanation, my answer is pretty much, "maybe, but maybe not." As I see it, all that stuff was basically a visual and narrative joke about how things always go well for "the cool guy." (Shit, I'm getting flashbacks. Remember how some burglar came and terrorized Ritchie and I guess Potsie, and Fonzie just put a chair against the doorknob of the room the guy was in and solved the problem in a second. "There's some hood out there with a pizza." Jesus Christ, where was that memory stored?)

Regarding Warp, the effects do wear off, yes. Getting away from the Fonzie model, if you really wanted to have a demonic mechanic, then you could do a Power roll for the Warp roll, which if successful would roll over into a genuine Cover-based roll actually to fix the thing for good.

Best, Ron
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Tasseomancer
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Posts: 13


« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2008, 03:25:15 PM »

Quote
Regarding Warp, the effects do wear off, yes. Getting away from the Fonzie model, if you really wanted to have a demonic mechanic, then you could do a Power roll for the Warp roll, which if successful would roll over into a genuine Cover-based roll actually to fix the thing for good.

"Whoa", and "Aaay!" while snapping his fingers, and forming a thrust-forward double thumbs up. Genius. Thanks.

Just one last off the wall question on this topic and I think it's exhausted. Can a demon confer an ability to another demon or it's spawn?

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Joel P. Shempert
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« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2008, 06:13:12 PM »

Y'know. . .I can't resist pointing out that the jukebox still never worked for anyone else; Fonzie always had to bang it to activate it. So just warp works fine.
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Story by the Throat! Relentlessly pursuing story in roleplaying, art and life.
zediekiel
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« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2009, 02:57:25 PM »

Could the jukebox be an item demon and the Fonz the master.  (que psychadalic drug trip and awe). 
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