Trying to figure out the anatomy of challenges I like
JoyWriter:
Did the test of power come after the test of intelligence? If so, I agree with Jeff, they could have just been tired and gearing back up to enjoying themselves. The big warrior might also have been more familiar, or a more familiar type of solution than the platforming one.
Apart from that, I think your analysis of the difference between the intelligence test and the other two is accurate.
ThoughtBubble:
Hey guys!
I haven't forgotten this thread, but this week has suddenly turned all crazy on me!
I'll have a couple more examples soon.
Daniel.
ThoughtBubble:
And I'm back. Sorry for the delay.
Jeff - You might be on the money with that. In the Test of Power there was a lot of everyone doing their own thing, that happened to work out into a nice sequence of events. In the Test of Agility, the Alien and the Speedster had the lead roles, most everyone followed what they were doing.
Callan - I think you're on something on that. When we're in combat, there is definitely a tendency towards "taking their turn and hitting someone." With this particular group, failure wasn't really an option, only setbacks. Having to start over on the jumps probably had had more threat than failing the combat though.
Filip - I hadn't really thought of consequences for failure. It probably would have ended with running away, resting up and starting again. The players also had to get the item awarded at the end of each test. In fact, I pretty rarely think about the consequences of failure beyond the most obvious. As far as the color code goes, I added that in on the fly.
Excalibur - Yeah, I definitely botched matching the intellect puzzle to my players. Two went "A puzzle? Nah," and checked out immediately. The two remaining ones began to argue about what the puzzle might mean. The remaining player (who sadly, missed most of the session) looked at it and immediately solved it. Heh. No fun for anyone really.
Josh - My players were probably gearing themselves back up, yes. Before last session I would have said combat was just less interesting (except in some wiggly games like D&D 4) but our last session of Mutants and Masterminds proved that wrong. We had a long running combat encounter that had the same flavor of awesome as the Test of Agility.
So, let's hit that example
The Challenge: Blow up the cloning facility
Our players are a set of elemental mages, currently trying to help a ghost haunting our Wind Mage. Functionally the ghost acts as his sidekick. Their investigations and help from an antagonistic NPC has lead them to a secret, underground lab where cloned bodies of the ghost are being grown. Their objective is to blow up the research notes and prototype cloning equipment. The Ice Mage is the player of the Alien Powerhouse from the superhero game.
The party bluffs their way past the guards with a "How dare you question me?" A quick infestation leads our party to the head scientist who happens to be our Ice Mage's grandfather. Some short debate later, and the new objective is to help Grandpa fake his death, then blow the place up. The Wind Mage and ghost find a body for the ghost to inhabit, then they proceed to explore the rest of the lab. They're noticed by the head guard who raises the alarm. Everyone at the table rolls their eyes and makes fun of the Wind Mage's player. Combat starts.
The Wind Mage ends up cornered by the guard who spotted him, and a hostile ghost. The Fire Mage runs to help him out, and the next few rounds are the Wind Mage attempting to defeat the ghost with his sidekick's help while keeping the Fire Mage and sidekick out of the ghost's area attack range.
The Fire Mage is mixing it up with the head guard and trying to keep him from double teaming the Wind Mage. After the Wind Mage beats the ghost, he uses a lot of helping actions on the Fire Mage's behalf till they beat the guard.
The Ice Mage seals the hall where most of the guards would come from, then spends the next few minutes in a game of cat and mouse with a huge brute that can break through any of her ice barriers in a single round. This was especially awesome because we both knew the brute could take her apart, and he proceeded to describe what he was going to do as he gave chase. When he finally managed to avoid her snare attack, there was a breathless moment of anticipation around the table, but I whiffed.
The Earth Mage grabs the explosives and begins using his powers to punch holes in walls, allowing him to avoid direct contact with the brute, and get around more quickly. He plants all the explosives, though a few failed roles mean that some are going to go off early. There's some good natured arguing going on between him and the Ice Mage's player as they keep crossing paths.
The guards finally manage to chip through the barrier and charge into the hall, only to get taken down by the ice and earth mages. The first bomb goes off, and caves in part of the ceiling. Guards from above the compound come in, but are rebuffed by harsh words from the Ice Mage and head back out without getting the rest of the guards.
At this point, the party attempts to defeat the brute as a group, and weaken him enough that when the rest of the bombs get set off early, the collapsing roof puts a stop to him.
The party extracts themselves from the rubble. After a brief conversation Grandpa sneaks away.
This had some of the same sense of fun that the Test of Agility had. It's also the best "move pieces on a grid" combat I've ever run. We were neck deep in what was going on. We used some basic moves in new, logical, but surprisingly effective ways. I was also really impressed how a trio of bluff checks were able to change the face of the rest of the dungeon. The first got them in successfully, the second got them to the scientist, and the third stopped the last wave of guards. Of course, getting to the scientist without a fight just meant that everyone else was still around when the alarm went off.
I should have one more example up tomorrow.
ThoughtBubble:
Last example!
This is from a game of Burning Wheel from a while ago.
The Challenge: Question/Rescue the Mob Boss's little brother
For a variety of personal reasons, each of the players are investigating the death of the local mob boss. The players have fallen into two factions as their events have crossed. 3 of the PCs are at an uneasy truce, including a Student with lots of connections. The fourth PC is a big city Adminstrative Investigator here to check out what's really going on. The trail of clues has led to the Mob Boss's little brother, currently captured and beign interrogated by the head of the town watch. As a favor to the other 2 characters, the Student Who Knows Everyone is going to try and break into the building where the mob boss's little brother is being questioned and get him out.
Meanwhile, our Administrative Investigator has tracked things down to the same point. She needs to question the mob boss's little brother as well, but he's resisted hours of pretty painful investigation so far. She manages to bully her way into the building to see someone else, but has no way to actually get the information she needs out of the brother.
A little later the Student has managed to circles and bluff his way in. Trying to walk around and check out the situation, he and sees the Investgator sipping tea and waiting for an opportunity. They're both quite familiar with the other by now. There's a hesitant moment where each wonder if the other will blow their cover. When that doesn't happen, they briefly discuss what they're trying to do, and make an arrangement. If the Investigator helps the Student get the brother out, The Student will help the Investigator get the answers she needs. The investigator intimidates her way into the room, and they manage to get some info from the little brother, but he's pretty badly beaten up and needs medical attention.
The two make a plan. The Student will raise a distraction out front, and the Investigator can sneak little brother out the back. The student manages to re-form an angry mob from earlier, and direct them at the house. The Investigator drags little brother out of the house in the confusion.
ThoughtBubble:
So, things that have been tickling in the back of my brain while writing that last post. I totally have expanded what I mean in challenges. Sorry about that. Those were just the situations I've come across that felt similar to the Test of Agility. There's that same flavor in all of the encounters. Let's look at our ingredients so far. Based off of people's comments I have:
1) Require some thinking
2) Need to use the character tools/resources available
3) Description
4) Consiquence
5) Unfamiliarity/Unpredictability
So, let's zoom on two exchanges on the test of agility.
The speedster is on the third platform with one end of the rope. The powerhouse is holding the rope on the second platform. The wizard and powersuit are also on the second platform. The powerhouse jumps and just barely makes it across to the third platform, but drops her end of the rope. The powerhouse takes the speedster's end of the rope, reels it in, then tosses the other end back to the second platform.
The powersuit ties it around his waist as a precaution before jumping. The powersuit jumps, and fails pretty bad, slamming into the pole holding up the platform. He fails his toughness save, ringing his helmet aginst the pole like a bell. He goes limp, and due to a failed roll on the powerhouse's part, jerks the rope out of her grip. The speedster dives for the rope, making his attack roll, but barely failing his strength check. So now he's got the rope, but is falling over the edge too. The powerhouse makes a grab for the speedster and makes it, then braces herself and pulls him back up. The two slowly reel up the powersuit. The powerhouse ties the rope around her waist so she can't lose it. Then they throw the rope to the wizard.
Looking at that, I'd add a 6th ingredient
6) Plausability.
There was no rule that "a rope will give you an XYZ check if you tie it around your waist and fail making a jump". It made sense that they could climb it, and there were rules for that. But every thing they did was perfectly plausable. Tying the rope around their waists? Perfectly plausable. Later portions, where the wizard tries rapelling up the pole? Perfectly plausable, but not explicitly options.
I think this has a pretty good sense of balance to Unpredictibility. Like "I should be able to gain an advantage by doing this reasonable thing with these items at hand. However, something unexpected, but within reasonable limits could still happen."
What's plausable, of course, varies from group to group.
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