DitV Conflict Tips?
Maestro:
This is valuable advice, thank you.
There are some additional challenges because I'm attempting to run a game in September which is based on following one long running mystery, rather than being traditionally town-based: http://www.indie-rpgs.com/forum/index.php?topic=17107.msg276588#msg276588
I know that I posted that in the wrong area, but I didn't see a button anywhere to edit my posts so I assumed the moderator will move/delete it if necessary.
The game I'm envisioning is somewhat less cowboy and gunslinger oriented. I'm also trying to think of creative ways to threaten their lives without shootouts - including demonic possessions that inflict higher D-sized fallout based on the current level of demonic influence, etc.
Getting the investigators divided on an issue will be very challenging given the nature of such a game. But I will think carefully on it. Giving NPCs more frequent actions in conflict had crossed my mind. I may simply allow them to Raise in retaliation whenever someone Raises against them. Allowing them to re-use previously rolled dice could greatly increase their longevity. (Length of the scene to be proper is far more important than the difficulty of the challenge mechanics-wise).
Paul T:
I read the linked post in the "Alternative Settings", and it sounds quite intriguing.
You may want to check out Vincent's putative game Afraid, which is a "horror" Dogs mod:
http://www.lumpley.com/comment.php?entry=201
As for helping you further, I have a few comments:
1. Balancing increased NPC effectiveness in conflict versus multiple players with the number of players involved is going to be tricky.
For example, using the "reuse dice from a See" rule will NOT work if the NPC/opposition is Raising as often as the PCs. The whole point of that rule is to scale against a varying number of PC Raises. If you alternate, it doesn't do anything.
Given the "hopeless", dark theme of your game, you might consider using the original rule, where the NPC can reuse all the dice used to See. Some players will be unable to make meaningful Raises on certain turns, but that might be fitting to the game.
Giving the NPC more dice, on the other hand, is problematic because a) it draws out conflicts and b) makes conflicts which involve fewer PCs too hard.
I might consider an alternative like increasing the number of Town Dice available to the GM based on the number of players. This would give you some flexibility in pacing, but the total number of dice would keep you "honest". It would still feel harsh and unfair sometimes from the player side, which might be just the thing you want.
2. Other than that, it's incredibly hard to give specific advice for the game without a clear idea of how the situations in the game are structured. Dogs has Town Creation and generally resolves each Town in 1 or 2 sessions.
Can you sure you prep/scenario structure for this game? That would help immensely. What's your version of Town Creation for this game, and how long do you expect a given situation to play out?
3. Creating difficult issues for the Dogs to potentially divide over sounds like it makes you uncomfortable. But I think it might be just the thing: yeah, you've got all this horrible stuff and violence and mistreatment, but why not make as human as possible, tied into whatever the Dogs care about, and the kinds of people that they are? Take their hopes and fears and twist them into what's happening, subverting each one.
Maestro:
I'm sorry it took so long for me to get back to you. My responses below:
1. Rules effectiveness is important to the game. Whatever I do, the mechanics of the game need to be sound. What I'm leaning towards right now at this minute is a combination of two half-solutions:
a) Allowing my PCs not to raise according to "best roll" / turn order, or in any sort of round-robin fashion. Instead, the PCs will raise when cinematically appropriate to do so, if there are multiples in the combat. I will also allow my NPCs to raise more than once per "round" - whenever it is appropriate for them to do so. I may, or may not, implement the rule where one of the dice they use to See can be re-used on their next See.
b) Assign additional Free Dice to towns, in the case that they CAN be rolled, but are not necessarily forced to be rolled in a combat. I also think that NPCs who are notable enough to demand PC team-ups to combat will have "Sorcerer" like powers and can roll / command the Demonic Influence as Free Dice for themselves to roll. This is much more significant than in the base game, because in the base game the level of Demonic Influence is set once, for the entire town. In my hack, each PC Character has his own current level of Demonic Influence. Thus, more dice to be used by the bad guy.
This is also partly balanced by the use of "Hunches" which can be used to guess an enemy's Trait Dice and roll free dice equal to the Trait guessed. (Incorrect guesses get them nothing though).
2. This is a good question which I am currently coming to grips with. At first, I'd intended to have the structure of the game roughly follow vanilla Dogs - i.e. Go to New York, investigate the murder of so-and-so, then follow the trail of the killer to Chicago, etc. Upon closer examination of the game as I've begun building it, that format is counter-productive. In order to encourage a broader story arc and more independent player actions and stories, the group will roughly be split into two groups of two investigators each at the very beginning of the game. From there, the game will follow a somewhat more traditional RPG story arc which will deal primarily with episodes, wherein the PCs discover the information which is meant to be discovered. I will present them with a limited part of the mystery, with the expectation that by the end of the session, they will have uncovered that much of the story.
I thought hard about making it more open-ended, which is after all the spirit of the Dogs game (and what I really love about it!) - but it just doesn't really work as well for a specific, assemble-the-facts murder investigation. The players could draw vastly different conclusions about who the actual killer(s) is/are, and I don't want to make the game that open-ended. I want to present a very tight, coherent story comprised of several different arcs that assembles into a cleanly constructed case. At the end of each session, I want them to really get how the different pieces are starting to fit together and go "oh yeah, that makes sense..." and also, "Where the heck is this next part leading to?"
The game's going to have a very particular pacing, and somewhat pre-planned scenes with a strong soundtrack and a chain of character-driven events. The players will have a choice as to when, and where, they explore the different arcs (for instance, if they choose to interview Dr. Holton at his place of work, or at his home), and there will be a chronology of events for each session which could lead players to catch people doing incriminating things, or even to drive them to take certain actions to either evade the law, rat our confederates, etc. Timing is important. But the actual events themselves will, at the end of each session, if planned correctly end with a certain pre-determined set of objectives fulfilled, so that they can head on to the next part of the story smoothly.
I think I conceptualize the game as an HBO miniseries. There's a mystery to solve, but the players need to pick up the clues to jump through a pre-planned series of hoops. How they discover the clues, and the actions they then decide to take on the information, are largely up to them. That's their share of the gameplay. They also take responsibility for crafting their individual and group stories, by choosing when and how they interact with their Demons. Are they growing over time, becoming more mature and stronger, or is the Demon (alcholism, past trauma, infirm mind, etc) getting the better of them? And how is their outlook affecting their relationship with the other characters, and any important NPCs in their lives? The players collaborate with me in building the story - I provide them with the raw clues and information that yields a convincing and dark tale of depravity and murder.
That was longer than intended. I hope it helps you understand where I'm coming from.
3. Intra-party conflicts does intimidate me slightly, yes. I'll tell you why.
First, this game is dealing with some heavy themes - deception, murder, fraud, integrity, loss, betrayal, hate, legality, etc. In that sense, it's similar to the base game of Dogs. However, there is no inherent bond of brotherhood shared merely because they're all Eyes. It isn't necessarily a fraternity of shared values. I'm worried that with the weight of the themes discussed, characters may take actions that lead to irrevocable, irreparable relationships between them. While that may make for some awesome story-telling, it could also badly disrupt the "flow" of the game in the directions I need it to go, depending on the specifics of how the sessions are planned.
I think I could handle the above - and, I've got a solid group of players who are mature enough to deal with it responsibly. But I don't yet have character concepts from all of them either, leading me to be cautious about over-planning how and why characters should feel a certain way. On one level, I think it's awesome. But I'm also trying to account for a larger story as well, and need to balance distracting vs. enhancing when assessing the appropriate level of infighting required. Then again, it also allows for some really cool manipulation of the mechanics - say I give one player the choice: "You know John's got a drinking problem." Then it's up to them to make a cutting remark and leave him alone with the bottle. And oh, if they do, they get to roll the dice for John's demon...
All the better if it leaves the conflict with damaging (and interesting!) fallout. :)
Thanks a lot for the feedback. I'm interested in continuing this discussion and getting more opinions on the game scenario. I appreciate your interest and advice!!
Maestro:
I hate to double post, especially because I feel like I'm the only one still reading this topic, but just in case anyone is interested, here's the character sheet that an artist friend and myself came up with for this Dogs mod:
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
I hope posting the image wasn't against any bandwidth rules! Enjoy.
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