[Sorcerer] First annotations available
Ron Edwards:
Hi Roger,
For your technical questions ...
My call is that the "flat" first session is actually a feature, not a bug. It's a process of learning that you can actually play your character rather than sift a bunch of chaff for clues, or be forced to care about some "mystery," or posture at one another over faction membership, or any of that other ass. It's also a process of learning that the diagram-based information is actually powerful and complex enough to become a foundation for play. I should also point out that the "flat" sensation is always restricted to the GM, based on expectations built from other games, and is usually subverted in practice when the players talk about how much fun they had.
I see what I need to clarify about Hint. The point of that ability is that the demon is actually ignored as a character. Don't think of it as talking to the demon, but rather as going through a door the demon opens. The Yes/No answer is actually delivered by the GM. The demon's knowledge, personality, and priorities have nothing to do with the answer at all. If the character wants to know X, and the Hint succeeds, then he or she now knows it, do not pass Go, no $200. Depending on the special effects, the demon might not even know it after using the ability.
I'd prefer not to get sidetracked by hypotheticals, but I was thinking in terms of concrete information, not "is there a God" or anything like that.
Regarding the three Rules, my thinking is that they are cumulative, not merely expressing the same thing twice. Therefore an un-Hosted, un-Bound, too-long-Need Parasite or Possessor is losing three at a time, not just one.
Some of your statements look like they might be questions, but I am not sure. Let me know if there's something in your post that you wanted me to address beyond what I've said here.
Best, Ron
Chris_Chinn:
Hi Ron,
You've stated that you're doing this as annotations and not revisions to the core text, so feel free to take my comments about seeing certain things earlier or later with a grain of salt. I'm mostly noting them from a point of ease-of-understanding for a new Sorcerer player, and that some ideas serve as critical context for other ideas.
Numbered for my own sanity, hopefully easier for you as well:
1.
I really like the Chapter Layout/Process of Play chart, and how you keep coming back to it and highlighting each step and how the procedures fit into that. I can really see how a lot of threads here at the Forge over the years have been around trying to communicate both the process and the "why" and this seems to do a great job of breaking it down.
2.
Chris Kubasik's comment about the division between a person vs. a sorcerer vs. a sorcerer under a kicker is a great point - and my most recent Sorcerer game really highlighted that issue for us.
3.
The contrast and compare of the way gamer issues or gamer traditions serve to avoid engagement is pretty useful and critical for a lot of gamers to transition into play.
4.
Descriptors as OTE traits is very illuminating. I really do wish that was part of the core text this whole time.
5.
The extra diagram procedures are very nice and useful for thinking about how this prep tool works.
6.
Your comments about the example characters, demons and power adjustments are the only points where I would seriously prefer to see the revised versions in the core book from get-go rather than annotated after the fact.
7.
"Don't drop the ball on me" etc. from that thread a while back- that's still gold and might do well earlier in the text. Or maybe not. It just seems very critical and serves as a fucking banner to wave about what this game is about. Putting it (or some version of) up front might give people better context as they go through the book.
8.
Desire & Need. This is an excellent explanation and I feel like it's a critical half to understanding demons as dysfunctional relationships. I'd also want to see some version of this earlier in the bo
9.
"Demons don't exist". I've personally found it easiest to describe this by pointing to horror movies: "Freddy Krueger. Jason. Candyman. See how they break they rules? It's not like there's a world full of these guys, or even totally clear rules on how they work. They shouldn't exist in the first place, but they do, and they're not going to stop. You? You got a demon that breaks the rules. It shouldn't be, and no one has a fucking clue how it really works. You just got the best guesses that seem to work."
10. James quote starting Chapter 7 is gold.
Chris
Ron Edwards:
Hi everyone,
Everything posted so far is being taken to the text and incorporated in some way. I'm not going into much discussion here because I need to concentrate on the writing, which I imagine is probably OK by you. But keep posting! And if there's something you'd like to see me respond to here (either posted already or after this one) then let me know.
I'm currently enjoying the work very much. Chapter 4 (the hardest) is now up to speed, although I haven't posted it, and I'm almost done with 5 and 6. You can probably imagine why they're the last, being most deeply embedded in the diagram.
Best, Ron
Per Fischer:
Nothing much to add apart from I'm loving this. I'm only in Ch. 2 because I went back a re-read the first part. It's golden for not only understanding the intentions behind Sorcerer's design, but also helps getting it and, I hope, helping one's co-players getting.
Personal favorites so far:
Ch 1: "To the player: nothing will take care of you. This game is not intended to preserve your character’s life, to make him or her look good all the time, or to make him or her the hero in some guaranteed way. The only thing the character can rely upon is you."
Ch 2: Replacing stat names with descriptors - thinking of them as traits, and the way they have to be focused as a defined list.
Thanks!
Per
James_Nostack:
Quote
I’ll deal with the single most problematic aspect of the demon ability rules right this moment. Take all mention of
distances and weights and cross’em off. Make them gone.
Laughing. So. Hard.
Thank you for that.
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