Satisfying the curious
tymotzues:
Hello folks
So I've recently published my first game Ascendancy - Rogue Marshal
It's doing ok so far, enough sales and interest to keep me happy, however, there are those out on there who are pressuring me to release game play exerts. While I understand their reasons for wanting to see a new system (FateStorm) put through its paces before laying down their hard won cash, I have reservations.
These mostly stem from two issues:
i) The system has a lot of facets to it which would not be visible in a dry and technical analysis of (for example) the conflict system.
ii) There are many things that may not be comprehensible to someone reading an example of play who hasn’t read the book and therefore cannot understand the various system influences or what they mean.
And so I am torn between wanting to satisfy their curiosity and ensuring that I don’t give an unreliable account of the system. Let me stress that my primary concern here is not the loss of sales from these people, but rather the creation of false assumptions which will misrepresent the system as a whole.
And so I need your help.
Ron made the suggestion that I post examples here for you to vet and give me your feedback on the above issues.
There is a bit more background on the issue here;
http://www.indie-rpgs.com/forge/index.php?topic=32847.0
And also a link to the example of play in the book which details a combat here;
http://www.fatestorm.com/fs_admin/FS_MechanicsExample.pdf
David Berg has already kindly read through the example and mentioned that it made his head hurt, I replied that much of that may be due to the fact that the example of play comes towards the back of the book as a guide to the GM and as such it is assumed that the majority of the book (and the system details) have already been read.
Your thoughts are welcome.
In addition I will follow on this post with the examples provided as part of the system chapter for you to compare with.
Obviously I want to show the system in the best light, and while neither of these examples shows the system to its full I am interested in your feedback as too whether:
i) The examples make sense
ii) Show the system in a positive light
iii) Would satisfy the curious as to how the wager system of resolution works.
Kind regards
T
Eero Tuovinen:
You should stop what you're doing on this right now and go read some successful actual play pieces. It's a form of essay writing with its own structural and stylistic tricks, and from your post it seems like you don't really have a lot of experience in reading or writing it. A good actual play report simply doesn't suffer from the problems you mention, because they're written with the appropriate amount of detail for the form and the audience.
I'll pick an arbitrary example of what to do and what not to do, and if it seems to you that this isn't something you're familiar with, then get thee hence and read how people do it successfully.A typical failure in reporting actual play is to go into much too much detail, and to fail in moving your descriptive viewpoint between the various layers of meaning that a roleplaying game has. For example, the traditional pre-Internet format that too many continue to use is to write your description of play as an entirely in-fiction story that strives towards literary value. Equally awkward and wrong-headed is to write in dialogue form, trying to replicate the table talk and system use in excessive detail. This kind of writing is dull and does not work for the purpose of entertaining and informative actual play report because you're constrained to write besides your point by your chosen form.The right way to dodge the above problems is to write with a clear agenda: this is what I want to say about this game, or this play experience I had. Then you start writing, and you write logically, remembering that your story is the story of what happened when people engaged in this creative task of playing the game. You will perhaps describe the fiction a bit, but mostly you'll concentrate on what the players are doing and why, what they're trying to accomplish and how they go about it. You will shift viewpoint as necessary: spend one paragraph to lay out what happened in the session before this one important scene, then another paragraph to explain some rules, then from the third paragraph onwards a detailed description of that one scene, and then some analysis to point out what you find remarkable in that interaction.The point is not to somehow give a complete and full picture of what a given rules-system is capable of; rather, the actual play format is best used in pin-pointing some specific feature, and how it operates in the context of the rest of the game.
For examples of good actual play reports, go to the forums (the Forge included) and see what people are liking. I'll give you something to start with: in his series of actual play reports in 2003 Ron Edwards introduced me to Tunnels & Trolls, an excellent classic of the dungeoneering genre of gaming. I'm sure that this piece is not to everybody's tastes, but at the time I found Ron easy to understand, and he discussed issues that I found interesting and illuminative; his writing directly engaged me to dig up the rules-texts for the game from my brother's rpg book stash, and I've since then played the game on several occasions very successfully. (Also, this piece sparked my on-going interest in old-school Dungeons & Dragons, logically enough.) No guarantees that this'll be illuminative for you, but that's why you should read many different writers writing actual play reports in different styles and for different purposes to get hang of the possibilities of the form.
Here's Ron's T&T trilogy:
1st thread
2nd thread
3rd thread
For a follow-up, here's where I ended up with T&T five years later - also an actual play report, to contrast with Ron's style. (Not that my style is that different, I've learned to focus on the interesting creative issues specifically from Ron's writing, and the general ambience of the classic Forge actual play reports.)
Chris_Chinn:
Hi,
Ideas take time and energy to digest just like food- so when you're trying to introduce people to your new game, you need to start simple - paint the broad strokes of what the game is and how it works. You can tie it to an Actual Play example of a single incident or two where a general set of rules helped produce something fun and how they did it.
Here's an example of me summarizing Burning Wheel and a similar description could do well for your game:
http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?464106-Burning-Wheel-How-does-it-work&p=10665779#post10665779
Notice I haven't gotten into nitty gritty specifics about mechanics at all in that description.
When you do an Actual Play description, talk about the highlights of play and how the rules brought that into being and what was working for it.
(When people who are already playing your game ask for examples/advice, then you can get into detailed specifics.)
Chris
tymotzues:
Thanks Chris
an interesting take. I haven't read BW or played it, but it seems to have some underlying tones to FateStorm to it, will take a look.
Thanks for the description as well.
Cheers
T
tymotzues:
Ok, so I'd like to know what you all think of this.
Hello
So in trying to answer a few requests about the system I’ll break it down from the broader game to an actual example of how the system works.
Avatars
There are four main components that go to create an Avatar;
The Archetype – a universal template associated with a guiding figure (warrior, thief, orphan)
Ruling Sign – similar to an astrological sign but more cosmological, influences fateful outcomes
Egoid – a racial or cultural template that determines knowledge, skills and special attributes
Vocation – a voluntary association with a particular role in societyStatistics
The Avatar has a range of statistics, but there are three main groups that go to determine most outcomes in the game;
Descriptors – these are base statistics of which there are four: Critical Effectiveness, Mental Agility, Personal Resonance, and Spiritual Resonance. They are associated with an element of Fire, Air, Earth and Water.
Attributes – There are four attributes which govern an Avatar’s ability to interact with the physical environment around them; Grounding, Command, Assea and Acumen
Aptitudes – these are the skills and knowledge that the Avatar has learnt.
Other statistics include; Prowess, Talents and Personalities as well as resources and allies.
Fate
The underlying currents of FateStorm are about how there is very little ‘coincidence’ in the lives of an Avatar. While their destinies are not known, what is known is that they have a destiny – and the game is about discovering what that is.
The system provides tools which enable non-random determination of outcomes, but without the outcomes being obvious. In addition there are FatePoints, which the players gain, loose and expend in order to increase their Avatar’s aptitudes, prowess or talents, and to use various aspects of fate.
Buying Fate – the Avatar’s unlike normal people, are linked in with the universe in a way which allows them to actually cause the threads of fate to bend, either aiding or ailing their efforts to succeed. The system allows the Avatar to buy fateful influences, such as miracles, catastrophes, elemental influence or even summon their Archetype to possess them during times of great need.
FateDeck – these cards are used in a multitude of ways, but they are generally used to allow the players and the fate a range of story options and to add an element of serendipity to play. Players can purchase a FateHand at any stage of play in order to influence events.
FateSphere – the FateSphere appears in the middle of the Avatar record sheet. It is split into elemental arcs as well as their associated Ruling signs. Used as diagram, it can determine the underlying relationships between the Avatar and any other individual. It can be used by the Fate to determine a bias in a given situation towards the Avatar, and is used as the calendar for the HeroCycle of the Avatar.
HeroCycle – the HeroCycle describes the underlying influences of the cosmos upon the life of the Avatar. At times the Avatar will have the favour of the cosmos, at other times they will be suffering from a lack of influence. The HeroCycle is unique for each Avatar, and as such, when Avatars work as a troupe, there will be times when some of them are more powerful than others in certain regards because their HeroCycle are waxing, while the others are waning. This forces all the players to have moments when their Avatar’s can achieve legendary feats without one Avatar overshadowing the rest. It creates a reliance on teamwork and memorable stories. The HeroCycle is considered an advanced tool in FateStorm and is therefore optional to the system.
The Basic Mechanics
So the system boils down to a fairly standard mechanic.
There is an Activity Rating (AR) determined, and known only, by the Fate (GM) for a given task.
The Avatar creates an Activity Pool (AP) which is then compared to the AR to determine the level of success. The typical AP is created by adding up a Descriptor+Attribute+Aptitude. Some AP such as the Combat Activity Pool (CAP), are pre-generated as they do not alter for their set purpose.
In any instance where the outcome is actively opposed by another then this is a duelled activity. In duelled activities each side creates an AP, these are then expended in a tit-for-tat fashion to try to gain the upper hand in the competition; whether it is a game of chess, melee combat or a verbal debate. Duelled activities are modified through any use of a special ability, prowess, talent, and of course roleplay.The use of AR and AP is not a simple black and white result (unless that is the Fate’s ruling), but there is room for partial successes to be achieved adding to the detail of the story.
Example of play
A troupe of Avatars have been pitted between an undead king and his similarly undead, estranged queen. The Avatars have returned from the queen and agreed to kill the king in return for a powerful magical artefact.
Returning to the king’s city, they intend to rest before confronting the king, who sent them to kill the queen and return with the artefact. As the troupe crosses a deserted market square the king, suspecting betrayal, has come out to meet them. The Avatar’s are powerful and the king, ever cautious decides to even the odds in his favour. From the shadows he executes a magical weave that causes the Archer Kalvar to become enthralled with the king.
The force of the weave is enough to beat Kalvar’s opposing activity pool, and so Kalvar becomes the kings unwitting pawn.
Halfway across the market square the king appears and challenges the troupe with sword drawn. The troupe try to bluff the king and there is a duelled conversation in which the king outwits the troupe and wins, thus showing the troupe mean to betray him.
Mal, the leader of the troupe, seeing that their ruse is over, agrees to hand over the artefact, a mask, and kneels down to retrieve it from his pack. But part of the deal the troupe made with the queen was to also gain a second artefact, the Sun Shard, which would help kill the king. Mal, makes an opposed activity check to hide the shard while retrieving the mask and approaches the king. While the rest of the troupe ready themselves.
The King anticipating a trap begins to cast a protection weave. Mando, the troupes tracker, shouts out a warning to Mal. Mal throws the mask before the king to try to distract him and combat begins.
Mal gains a small advantage over the king and gets initiative pulling the sun shard from its hiding place to dazzle the king. But the king has already finished his protection weave and while the shard’s light engulfs him in pain, he survives taking penalties and thus lowering his chance of initiative even further. Mal now firmly with the upper hand draws his sword and strikes the king across the chest. The king desperate not to abandon any hope of regaining momentum lets the blade strike, relying upon his armour to take the blow, which it does.
Meanwhile Roq, another of the troupe’s warriors has flanked the king and charges in from the side, his sword biting through the kings armour and into his shoulder.
Behind them all Mando and Qarim, the troupe’s healer, watch as Kelvar raises his bow and fires into the melee. Thinking that he was aiming for the king they yell out in horror as the arrow drives into Mal’s back.
Kelvar, under the king’s control, acts to aid the king. The king wants Kelvar to defend him, but this is as far as his instructions can go. With four companions to choose from to attack the Fate looks to Kelvar’s Ruling sign and compares it with those of the other troupe members. The leylines between Kelvar and Mal are strong, and opposed and so the Fate determines that Mal will be the focus of Kelvar’s attack. The king meanwhile takes the opportunity to level a fate catastrophe against Mal. This means that Kelvar’s attack will be immensely more powerful and cause a critical wound.
Qarim now has the initiative and races across the market square towards where Mal is falling to the ground. Kelvar’s arrow protruding through his chest.
The king meanwhile has been executing another weave ignoring the attacks from Mal and Roq in the process. His concentration good enough to focus even through the damage. Completing the weave a wave of fire blasts outwards across the troupe, bringing Roq and Qarim to a halt.
Mando, still awaiting a chance to act can only cry out helplessly as Kelvar levels another arrow and fires it at Qarim. Qarim, while running, isn’t such an easy target as Mal was however and he misses. Mando knows she is not physically capable of overpowering the archer so instead leaps infront of Kelvar and kisses him. She calls a fate miracle in order to break the charm the king had placed upon him and Kelvar staggers back in shock.
Roq, recovering from the fire blast raises his sword for a killing blow, the blade lances down but the king twists aside at the last moment and replies with a backward thrust.
Roq having used every once of strength and preparation he had in attempting the killer blow is left exposed and the kings blade bites through armour, skin and bone.
Mando and Qarim now at Mal’s side see that the arrow has pierced his heart and he will be dead in seconds. Qarim seeks to find a solution, magical or otherwise and decides upon a desperate plan. Using a fate miracle and her magic, she breaks off the front and back of the arrow and then heals Mal’s heart with a piece of the arrow shaft still inside.
He will live, but his close call with death will have a permanent effect, and he will suffer a loss to one of his attributes as a result.
Roq, grabs the kings sword and with his other hand swings his own sword into the kings side. This time the king has no where left to turn and is helpless to get away from the blade. It cuts deep into his abdomen and he is pinned.
Mando snatches up Mal’s dropped cutlass and thrusts it deep beneath the kings breastplate, with an all or nothing strike.
There is a moment of stillness as the king’s sword drops from his silk gloved hand to chime upon the tiled ground as the king collapsed forward. Dead.
Does it need more technical explainations?
Cheers
T
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