Finishing up
Ron Edwards:
Hi,
We're in the final weeks! The closure is still on schedule for June 1.
I was thinking of opening a "Bye!" forum, sort of like the old Birthdays forums, for anyone's closing statements, during the final week or so. Since I was apparently the sole person in the universe who disliked those forums, this was one of those "boy everyone will love it" vs. "shit I hate that" moments. I'm probably going to do it, though.
If I do, I think I will take great pleasure in sinking any posts that annoy me for any reason during that time ... in fact, maybe even moving them to yet another temporary forum called "My head won't fit up my ass but I'm trying" or something like that. Or maybe that will remain a lovely dream, and I won't.
What's coming after
Sooner or later, this domain name will house a big wiki. Its main page is a graphic of the Big Model. You can click on any layer and that takes you into the standard wiki pages with explanations, including nested terms, cross-references, and links to the original discussions. The current Forge and the pre-2008 Forge Archive will remain exactly as they are (including articles), but closed to posting, and the wiki basically dips into them, and you can navigate around in them just as you can now, if you want.
I'd like to generate access to some publishing insights and to some "how this game started" thread families as well, but I'm still thinking about how to do it. Maybe those will be part of the wiki, maybe not.
I'm also not psychologically able to stop forum-style posting, I think. So the Adept Press forum will be housed at my own site, and I think I'll have both Actual Play and Game Design get rolling there too - but more in a personalized, Anyway style of discussion format. I'll be posting about my own play experiences and my own game designs, and encourage others to do the same if they feel like getting my input or input from anyone else who happens to frequent the site. I have no idea what sort of demand for this may exist out there.
Questions & concerns are welcome.
Best, Ron
Erik Weissengruber:
A question on process:
Did you think it would it have taken a decade + to get tot he point where you could present the big model in wiki form?
And, looking back, did you really need the forums to work out the big model in its final form? I remember Charles Olson saying something about participating in an "institution" like a college to be able to think, and that solo reflection didn't allow him to do the "thinking" he wanted to do.
Did the Forge work that way for you?
Ron Edwards:
Hi Erik,
I didn't have any plans or expectations for a summary or conclusion site back when Ed and I founded the Forge (then Hephaestus' Forge), nor when Clinton and I revised it. Nor did I aim toward such an inclusive model from the start. I did want to generate a useful cross-reference of goals with methods among a community of people interested in designing and publishing games, and I knew we'd have to clear out quite a thicket of misinformation and habitual falsehood to do so. But my plan or at least my personal goal was to get that established fairly early and to move on to discussing and refining techniques in the context of making new games.
All of which did happen, but I certainly didn't expect that the cross-reference part would generate so much fury over identity politics, clouds of horse-shit-dust, and periodic across-the-internet tantrums, at all, let alone persist. I was and am still astounded that anyone cared so much, and given that they did, I would have greatly preferred to have been written off as marginal from the start, at least about that stuff. I guess it all arose from the fact that many, many more people were indeed having a lot less fun than I would have believed back then, and were simultaneously invested in and resistant to the concepts.
By contrast, I'm really happy that the site brought independent RPG publishing out into the light as fast as it did; that was the part I expected to be slower.
The discussion context was incredibly important. That's why I'm trying to preserve the history through the links, and to permit anyone to decide whether what's in the wiki really is the best conclusion given what was discussed, to give credit to the authors of crucial concepts and innovative techniques. I think I did my part for both, but I certainly wasn't alone, and even stuff that I can claim authorship for wouldn't have arisen in the first place without others' ideas or challenges.
Best, Ron
Troy_Costisick:
Ron,
Do you have a secret list of "Best of" threads that you personally have referenced over the years? If so, any plans to share such a list with those who happen upon the site after it closes?
Peace,
-Troy
Ron Edwards:
Hi Troy,
I have no secret list. I typically run searches to find threads I need when I compose complex replies, and it so happens that a few do continue to be used a lot because the searches keep including them. Moreno's summaries in the Archives forum are finding a lot of those too.
The wiki includes links for the various terms and ideas, which will necessarily produce a best-of archive, I think. Suggestions will always be welcome, but it would be most helpful to wait until you can see what's already there. Or you can join Moreno in thinking of an interesting topic, then compiling a list of links in the Archive section. You can bet I'm going to those to help with the wiki.
I also plan to compile and organize actual play links for others' games to showcase at the Adept Press site (links for mine are already there), as well as a Ronnies summary in some detail.
Best, Ron
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